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Written by  on January 26, 2015 

 

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TIMEFRAUD
IS IT COUNTERFEIT OR NOT

WHILE THE VINTAGE WATCH INDUSTRY HAS SEEN SOME OF IT’S GREATEST GROWTH IN 50 YEARS,  IT IS STILL COSTLY TO BUILD A SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS IN THIS INDUSTRY. PAYING CLOSE ATTENTION TO THE RESTORATION  AND OVERHAUL OF  VINTAGE WATCHES IS ONLY THE BEGINNING. WATCH RESTORATION EXPERTS MUST STRIVE TO MAINTAIN THE INTEGRITY OF THE INDUSTRY. AS VINTAGE WATCH DEMAND GROWS, ALONG WITH OFFERS FROM INTERNATIONAL SELLERS, SO DO THE FAKE, COUNTERFEIT AND FRANKEN-WATCH OFFERS GROW. WHEN A WATCH PATRON DISCOVERS THEY WERE RIPPED OFF, THEN THESE WATCH PATRONS BEGIN TO QUESTION AND ACCUSE AND POINT FINGERS AND MISS-TRUST THOSE LEGITIMATE VENDERS WHO REQUIRE THE PATRON’S SUPPORT.

GOLDSMITHWORKS PULLS UP TO 1000 NEW BROWSERS TO EBAY EVERY MONTH. WE ARE PROUD OF THIS FACT AND WE THANK ALL OF YOU FOR VISITING US AND OUR PARTNER EBAY.  WE HOPE THIS PAGE WILL ASSIST YOU IN INVESTING WITH GENUINE PRODUCT DEALERS.

THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT MADE IT A FACT THAT VARIOUS ONLINE VENUES AND ENTITIES ARE NO LONGER REQUIRED BY LAW TO REMOVE IMITATION OR COUNTERFEIT ITEMS [WATCHES] UNLESS THE ACTUAL OWNER OF THE TRADE MARK COMPLAINS.  THIS MEANS THE INVESTOR/BUYER  CAN NO LONGER COUNT ON THE SALES ENTITY AND/OR VENUE TO PROTECT THEM FROM COUNTERFEITERS, “FAKERS” AND/OR  COPIED ITEMS. THUS, IN THE CASE OF FAKES, IT GETS COMPLICATED: WHERE IS THE RIGHTS HOLDER FOR A COUNTERFEIT 1942 MILITARY ISSUED BULOVA?

NOTE:  (GOOGLE) SUPREME COURT RULING IN TIFFANY LAW VS EBAY

THE FACT IS, THE PROBLEMS WE FACE ARE MORE THAN UNKNOWINGLY INVESTING IN AN OUT RIGHT FAKE ITEM MADE WITH THE INTENTION OF RIPPING OFF US BUYERS AND PATRONS. THOUGH OUT RIGHT FRAUD IS OCCURRING AT AN HORRIFIC MAGNITUDE AND PACE, AS LONG AS NO ONE IS AWARE AND/OR COMPLAINTS DO NOT REACH A CERTAIN THRESHOLD,  THOSE CREATING PRODUCT, IN OUR CASE VINTAGE WATCHES, UTILIZE CHEAP, POORLY MANUFACTURED PRODUCTS THAT ARE LABELED MILITARY WATCHES AND VINTAGE HIGH END TIME PIECES. THE MAIN FACTS IS THAT  UNDER THIS POLICY MANY ITEMS ARE NOT EVEN REPLICA WATCHES; WATCHES MADE TO LOOK AND ACT LIKE THE REAL DEAL.THE OTHER AMAZING FACTOR IS THAT A [MAINLY FOREIGN] COUNTERFEITER/”FAKER” CAN LABEL PLACE THE WATCH IN A REPLICA CATEGORY YET ADVERTISE IT AS GENUINE. 

THESE FACTS HAVE LOWERED THE PRICES FOR THE REAL MILITARY AND/OR VINTAGE WATCH RESTORES AND MADE THE SALE OF THE SAME DIFFICULT. HONEST DEALERS ARE FORCED TO LOWER THEIR PRICES IN THE FACE OF THESE FAKE WATCHES. IN ADDITION,  WHEN PEOPLE FIND OUT THEY WERE RIPPED OFF AND COMPLAIN TO THEIR FRIENDS AND ASSOCIATES, THE ENTIRE INDUSTRY SUFFERS; WHY BUY A WATCH THAT GOLDSMITHWORKS PAID A MEMBER, SAY, 150.00 FOR, THEN RESTORED AND REBUILT AT A COST OF 150.00, AND OFFERED FOR 350, WHEN THE PERSON CAN BUY AN ALLEGED  “GENUINE” VINTAGE ALLEGEDLY SERVICED FOR 100? EVEN THOUGH THE COMPANY IS OFFERING AN OUT RIGHT FAKE BRAND AND/OR RARE VINTAGE BRAND.

MANY VENUE MEMBERS CONTINUE TO BID ON OUT RIGHT FAKE VINTAGE WATCHES AND VINTAGE GOVERNMENT ISSUED  MILITARY WATCHES . HUNDREDS OF OUT-RIGHT FAKE MILITARY WATCHES ARE BEING SOLD UNDER ” PRIVATE ” AUCTIONS TO UNSUSPECTING BUYERS. PRIVATE MEANS ONCE WATCH IS SOLD THOSE INDIVIDUALS DESIRING TO INFORM THE BUYER CANNOT CONTACT THE BUYERS BECAUSE THE ITEM NUMBER AND INFO ARE PRIVATE

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THE ABOVE PHOTOS ARE WATCHES THAT ARE 100%
FAKE FRAUDULENT WATCHES

HEREWE HAVE TWO FAKES. THESE ARE NOT  COUNTERFEIT, BECAUSE THEY WERE NEVER MADE BY THE COMPANIES ATTRIBUTED TO IN THE SIGNINGS ON THE MOVEMENTS. THUS THEY WERE NOT ISSUED BY THE COMPANIES UNDER ANY CONTRACT AND ARE NOT IN ANY US GOV CONTRACT SPECS. THEY ARE  FAKES INSCRIBED WITH THE NAMES OF LEGITIMATE COMPANIES AND SOLD AS SOMETHING THEY ARE NOT.

A FAKE BREITLING AND JLC, YET THEY BOTH HAVE THE SAME MOVEMENTS. FOR LUXURY BRANDS THIS NEVER OCCURRED.

LIKE THE BREITLING AND LECOULTRE, THE TWO TOP MOVEMENTS ARE ALSO FAKE /FRAUDULENT. ONE IS AN ALLEGED ELGIN AND THE OTHER A WALTHAM . AGAIN , THE  DEAD GIVEAWAY BEING BOTH MOVEMENTS ARE ALIKE. NEITHER ARE ACTUAL MOVEMENTS USED IN MILITARY WATCHES IN THE USA OR ANYWHERE ELSE .

THE FACT IS  MOVEMENTS OF SEPARATE BRANDS BEING EXACT IS SIMPLY UNHEARD OF IN MILITARY ISSUED WATCHES

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THE US GOVERNMENT ACTUALLY REQUIRED DIALS TO BE EXACTLY ALIKE. HARDLY ANY VIETNAM ERA WATCH HAD NAMES ON THE DIAL. LOOK AT THE TOP US GOV PHOTO OF ACTUAL DIALS. THEY HAD TO BE EXACT AS TO THE SPECIFICATIONS FOR THAT MODEL.

THE EXCEPTIONS TO THE RULE CONCERNING NAMES ON DIALS WERE FEW. THE ABOVE RIGHT DIAL HAS “MFR’S NAME ” ON IT. THE SPEC CALLED FOR IT. THIS IS THE FAMOUS BULOVA FIRST NAVY AUTOMATIC DIVE WATCH CONTRACT  THAT WAS ASSUMED BY BLANCPAIN .

NOTE THE DIAL IS FOR THE DIVE WATCH OUTLINED IN THE 1961 MIL-W-22176 AND 1961 + MIL-W-22176-A SPECIFICATIONS.

THIS WOULD BECOME THE PLANS FOR BLANCPAIN’S FIFTY FATHOMS. BUT IT WAS ACTUALLY DESIGNED BY THE US NAVY. SEE THE ROUND MOISTURE INDICATOR AT BOTTOM ABOVE SIX? IT WAS DESIGNED IN 1960. BLANCPAIN WOULD MAKE 10,000 WATCHES FOR THE NAVY SEALS. THEN WOULD USE THE DESIGN AS “Milspec 1” WHICH MEANT “MILITARY SPECIFICATIONS 1” (THE ACTUAL NAVEL SPECIFICATIONS ARE ON TIMEFRAUD. THUS THE DATING OF THE WATCH AND THE ACTUAL SPECIFICATIONS ARE REQUIRED IN MANY CIRCUMSTANCES TO DISCOVER THE FACTS OF DIALS AND DATES OF PRODUCTION.

NOTE THE GG-W-113 HAS NO NAME.. OK? IF YOU READ CASE BACK AND IT HAS 113 THEN EXPECT NO NAME ON DIAL.

THE A-17 HAD NO NAME… IT HAD RADIUM NUMERALS. LOOK AT THE PICTURE ABOVE! IF THE DIAL LOOKS LIKE ALL THE OTHER FAKES WITH OFF BLACK DIAL WITH YELLOWISH EVERYTHING ELSE SO PERFECT AND NEAT IT IS A FAKE UNLESS DESCRIBED IN DETAIL, AND I MEAN DIAL. THE 3118A HAVE HAD BULOVA ON THE DIAL WHICH HAD TO BE ALLOWED AND REQUESTED BY CONTRACT AND SPECS!

THEY WERE ALL  NOTE THAT WHEN YOU SEE THE FAKES YOU WILL RECOGNIZE THEM IF YOU SIMPLY LOOK!

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WESTCLOX BENRUS ET AL. HAD THEIR OWN MOVEMENTS AND THEY LOOK AND ARE SIGNED AND MADE DIFFERENT EVEN IF THE CASES LOOK THE SAME.

THE CASES ON US GOV MIL ISSUE MILITARY WATCHES WERE ALWAYS EXACT TO A CERTAIN DEGREE TO THE SPECS, GET THE ID FROM THE CASE BACK. THE MODEL NUMBER A GOOGLE IT BEFORE YOU INVEST OR BID. USE PICTURES TO SPEED THE PROCESS. COMPARE.

CHECK CASE BACKS FOR SPELLING ERA’ LIKE THE WORD “SPECIFICATION” OR HOW THE WRITING IMPRINTING PRESSING STAMPINGS ARE.

IF YOU KNOW IT IS A FAKE AND BUY IT EVERYONE IS GETTING RIPPED — SOMETIMES IT TAKES TIME TO KNOW, LIKE WHEN IT BREAKS AND THE WATCH MAKER SAYS I CANNOT FIX THIS FAKE

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FAKE WESTCLOX OD PLASTIC CASED VIETNAM ERA MILITARY ISSUE ARE COPIED AND FAKED . LOOK FOR SLOPPY AND MISS-ALIGNED INFO ON CASE BACK. BROAD ARROW AND WWW CASE BACKS ADVERTISED AS US GOV MIL ISSUE ARE FAKE. PERIOD. A-7 DESIGNATION ON CASE BACK ARE FAKE. PERIOD. CASE BACKS WITH SPELLING WRONG ARE FAKE, PERIOD. A-17 OR A-17A ARE FAKE IF THE DIALS ARE NOT LIKE THOSE IN THE #2 PICTURE ABOVE.  AND, WITH HE EXCEPTION OF THE RARE BULOVA/BLANCPAIN NAVY DIVE WATCH EARLY 1960’S, ANY US GOV MILITARY ISSUED WATCH WITH AUTOMATIC MOVEMENT IS FRAUD FAKE AND A RIP OFF. YOU WILL HAVE TO LIE AND COMMIT FRAUD IF YOU READ THIS AND BUY ONE OR HAVE ONE AND RESELL IT AS  WHAT IT IS NOT: GENUINE.

OH.. LET ME HELP YOU OUT. IT SEEMS THE SAME COMPANIES ARE MAKING UP THESE FAKES.

A) SPECIFICATION NOT SPELLED CORRECTLY 60%

B) MFR’S IS NOT SPELLED CORRECTLY

C) A-7 IS A NO BRAINER. NOT UNLESS IT IS A POCKET WATCH CHRONO LONGINES GALLET MOVEMENT ONE BIG POCKET TYPE CROWN WITH PUSHER IN CENTER ALSO NOTE WORDS AVIGATION AND THE MISSPELLING MIR’S INSTEAD OF MRF’S AND SPICIIICATION INSTEAD OF SPECIFICATION. A FAKE SOLD ON EBAY AROUND 9-06/2012 FOR OVER 200.00 US!

D) THE CASE BACK HAS ELGIN STOCK NO 10BNCH OR WALTHAM STOCK NO 10BNCH AND THEN THESE LETTERS/NUMBERS 10BNCH . THE 10BNCH IS THE BULOVA HACKING MOVEMENT PLACED ONLY IN THE BULOVA MIL ISSUE BULOVA STOCK NO. 10BNCH. SO BULOVA STOCK NO 10BNCH WOULD BE PROPER.. BUT EVEN THEN, CHECK WHAT WE ARE SHOWING YOU .

E) BULOVA DID NOT, I REPEAT, DID NOT RECEIVE CONTRACTS FOR VIETNAM ERA GOV MIL SPEC ISSUE WATCHES. WE HAVE THE APPEAL OF BULOVA TO THE U.S. MILITARY BOARD AND THEIR DENIAL TO ALLOW BULOVA TO BE OFFERED CONTRACT FULFILLMENT. BENRUS WAS THE WINNER..

F) BRITISH MILITARY WWII AND AFTER W.W.W. [WRIST WATCH WATERPROOF] AND 1500′ ON, BRITISH BROAD ARROW DESIGNATION SPECIFICATION IS ONLY ON BRITISH WATCHES AND THE BRITISH HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH VIETNAM. ALL THROUGH TIME.. LITERALLY, THE BRITISH ADDED BROAD ARROW TO CASE BACKS AND ON SOME DIALS, WWI, WWII THE 1950’S AND 1960’S, ON TIMERS IN THE 1980’S. THE BRITISH WAR DEPARTMENT ORDERED MILITARY WATCHES DESIGNATED W.W.W FOR WATCH WRIST WATERPROOF. THESE W.W.W. WATCHES WERE TO HAVE BLACK RADIUM DIALS, 15 JEWEL MOVEMENTS, SUB SECONDS- PERSPEX SHATTER RESISTANT GLASS, STRONG CASES WITH EXTRA WATER PROOFING AND LARGE CROWNS. 12 MANUFACTURERS BUREN, CYMA, ETERNA, GRANA, IWC , JLC, LEMANINA, LONGINES, OMEGA, RECORD, TIMOR and VERTEX] SELECTED TO FILL THE ORDERS. EACH WOULD PRODUCE WATCHES SIMILAR TO EACH OTHER. ALL WOULD HAVE SCREW DOWN CASE BACKS EXCEPT IWC, WHO UTILIZED A SNAP CASE BACK WITH A LEAD WASHER SEAL.

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ANOTHER TARGET FRAUD IS THE ORD. DEPT WATCHES WE DISCOVER FROM ASIA. OR SOMETIMES THE US BUT ARE FROM ASIA. NOTE ABOVE. THEY HAVE USED A COUNTERFEIT DIAL WITH GREEN ILLUMINATED TRIANGULAR MARKERS. THEY PLACED A HAMILTON NAME WITH THE H LOGO — DUH– SCREAMS FAKE. THEN THEY CNC THE CASE BACK. BUT THE GIVEAWAY IS THE MOVEMENTS. YOU SEE IT IS A 1950’S AUTOMATIC. NONE WERE UTILIZED IN US GOV ISSUE MIL WATCHES. AND WHY DID I SAY CNC CUT CASE BACK? THE CASE IS FOR AN AUTOMATIC. SO THEY DID NOT USE A MIL CASE, CASE BACK AND DIAL AND SIMPLY CHANGE THE MOVEMENT. THE ENTIRE ENSEMBLE IS FAKE. MEANING THE BACK CASE WAS CARVED AND NOT STAMPED – ONE CAN TELL BECAUSE IT IS NO PERFECT.

 

6.

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WHEN YOU SEE CASES TAKE THE TIME TO ASK VENDER WHAT ERA, WHAT IS ON CASE BACK. THEN GOOGLE IT BEFORE YOU MAKE A BID

ADVERTISED

“THE HIL-W-3818A  BRAND ???????  U.S. NAVY MILITARY     ????EXCELLENT  WORKING COLLECTIBLE CONDITION US NAVY SIGNED ON FACE AND US NAVY W.W.W. ON STEEL CASE BACK. HIL-W-3818A SERIAL NO A7845 NO 6645-808-1407 EXCELLENT CONDITION MOVEMENT. VINTAGE ISSUE OLIVE NYLON STRAP.  THE US NAVY SIGNED DIAL IS PAINTED BLACK WITH Ã?Â?KHAKIÃ?Â?

THE FAKE –NOT COUNTERFEIT– US NAVY WWW WRIST WATCH IS FRAUD AT IT’S BEST. EVERY THING PART AND NOTATION IS FRAUDULENT. ALL DESIGNED TO STEAL YOUR MONEY. EVER GO TO RESELL? WELL, YOU CAN BE CHARGED WITH FRAUD! CAUSE IT IS FAKE

FAKE ELGIN, OMEGA, WALTHAM , LECOULTRE, BULOVA, WESTCLOX…  US NAVY US ARMY WWW BROAD ARROW DIALS ALL THE SAME MOVEMENTS THE SAME WITH DIFFERENT BRANDS, AUTOMATICS , CASES THE SAME YET UNLIKE WHAT YOU SEE WHEN YOU Google THEM…..

THE US GOVERNMENT, WITH ONE EXCEPTION, THE BULOVA/BLANCPAIN NAVY DIVER, NEVER EVER CONTRACTED OR PRODUCED GOV SPECS FOR AUTOMATIC MOVEMENT WATCHES. THE ONLY ONE WAS THE DIVE WATCH WE DISCUSSED..

ABOVE  WE HAVE A FAKE LONGINES THE DIAL IS NOT A LONGINES DIAL THAT IS ON THE A-7 AND LONGINES NEVER MADE A DIAL LIKE THIS NO LONGINES WERE MADE FOR VIETNAM AND IN WWII LONGINES MADE MILITARY WATCHES BUT NOT THE TYPE OFFERED THROUGH US GOVERNMENT AND THE DIALS WERE WHITE OR BLACK WITH RAISED RADIUM NUMBERS WITH 24HR ALSO ON SOME.

WHEN WE LOOK AT THIS MOVEMENT WE SEE CHEAP ALSO WE SEE A 360 DEGREE AUTOMATIC MEANING THE ROTOR SPINS 360 DEGREES ONLY THE BUMPER 180 WAS AVAILABLE BEFORE 1950 OR A RARE ROLEX 360. FACT IS, AS I SAID, NEVER EVER A US MILITARY WATCH NOR A LONGINES MOVEMENT

 AND, AS DESCRIBED BELOW,  UNDER A-7  AVIGATION, THE TYPE A-7 WAS BEFORE THE A-8 JITTERBUG NAV 1938 TIMER  AND THE 1942 A-11 HACKING PILOTS WATCH . THE A-7 WAS A CHRONOGRAPH WITH GALLET CHRONO MOVEMENT WITH LARGE CROWN WITH CENTER BUTTON IN CROWN IT WAS MORE LIKE A POCKET WATCH  CASE  WITH TWO SUB-DIALS ON THE MAIN DIAL

NOW FOR THE BIGGEST FAKE, THAT IS USING THE DESIGNATION # SPEC SHEET NO. THE NAME A-7

THE  US MIL A-7 WATCH. YOU WILL SEE TONS OF WATCHES WITH A-7 ON BACK CAUSE? IT IS HARD TO FIND THE REAL A-7

SO WE DECIDED TO SHOW YOU ONE….:

THE A-7 A-8 AND A-11 ARE DESIGNATIONS OF SPECIFICATIONS THAT PRODUCED MILITARY ISSUE WATCHES WW11 AND BEFORE.

A) THE A-7 WAS THE 1930’S “AVIGATION” WATCH

B) THE A-8 IS THE FAMOUS JITTERBUG NAV TIMER

C) THE A-11 FAMOUS HACKING PILOTS WATCH. EACH WERE MADE FOR WW11

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THE AVIGATION WAS THOUGHT TO BE A COOL NAME FOR NAVIGATION AND AVIATION.
THE FACT IS, THIS IS THE HARDEST WATCH TO FAKE.

LOOK, BREITLING JAEGER LECOULTRE OMEGA DID NOT HAVE US  MILITARY CONTRACTS FOR WATCHES. WATCHES STATED AS AMERICAN US NAVY ARMY –WHAT EVER — WITH “W.W.W. AND/OR “BROAD ARROW” ON CASE BACK ARE FAKES. THESE ARE BRITISH DESIGNATIONS -ESPECIALLY OFFERS WITH THE WORD “VIETNAM” IN THEM.  NOTE NO BRAND ABOVE? AS IF THE GOV MADE THE WATCH. AN THIS OMEGA FAKE SOLD FOR SOME LARGE BUCKS.

AGAIN IT WAS A FAKE

IF THE MOVEMENT IS NOT SHOWN DO NOT BUY UNLESS YOU ARE SURE.

SO ASK QUESTIONS OR VISIT THE HELP SITE TIMEFRAUD. TIMEFRAUD

TIMEFRAUD IS OPEN TO THE PUBLIC TO POST, ADD INFORMATION AND PROVIDE ANY CORRECTIONS OF CONTENT THAT EXISTS.

ALL PICTURES IN/ON TIMEFRAUD AND HERE IN THIS GUIDE ARE UTILIZED UNDER THE FREEDOM OF THE PRESS AND IST AMENDMENT CLAUSE OF THE US. CONSTITUTION. THEY ARE UTILIZED TO REPORT INFORMATION IMPORTANT TO THE PUBLIC AND AS SUCH, ANY CAUSE OR ACTION UNDER LAW SHALL BE FILED/HEARD IN THE NORTHERN DISTRICT FEDERAL COURT OF GEORGIA . IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING TO ADD, OR TO CORRECT, PLEASE EMAIL THE POSTER.

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